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 Post subject: Re: Recall??
 Post Posted: Mon Mar 08, 2010 7:12 pm 
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Location: Fairfax, VA
Julie brought up some great points about the recall and corrections in general. Always start with the lowest correction possible and work your way up if you have too. I am all for shock collars if used properly but you can destroy a dog with abusing the shock collar. I have seen it and I have seen it in a Lacy. Alot of the recall comes from different situations and different environments. AND it's going to be tough with a Lacy in a prey drive. Real tough. So the reward of coming back to mom or dad better be great. And this reward will vary depending on the dog and the dog may even surprise you. Roush's recall reward is being loved and praised by me. He is super food motivated but in a recall situation works best for my love. So I guess you need to figure that out as well.

Having a good foundation on obedience strengthens a dogs ability to be successful with more advanced training. I recently read an article about a simple recall training method using a whistle. Blow the whistle, the dogs is curious and comes to you, dog is rewarded. Simple. Then just build upon it - distance, situation, environment. And you can either carry a whistle with you when you think a recall will be needed or use your mouth and whistle as loud as you can. A good harsh NO before starting the actual recall command can always help.

-Chris

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 Post subject: Re: Recall??
 Post Posted: Mon Mar 08, 2010 8:26 pm 
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Roy has a very loud whistle and is able to use it very effectively on the dogs. It doesnt always work, but if he catches the dogs before they are in full blown pursuit, they will come back. Since the lacy ranges out so far, sometimes it is impossible to catch them when they start chasing something. I have to get me a good whistle, I know it would make a difference.

Betty

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 Post subject: Re: Recall??
 Post Posted: Mon Mar 08, 2010 9:09 pm 
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I posted it on here before but with what Betty said, i have used a coachs whistle and hotdogs to teach recall. it works well when they know they get a treat when they come back.

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 Post subject: Re: Recall??
 Post Posted: Tue Mar 09, 2010 8:32 am 
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ChrisnRoush wrote:
A good harsh NO before starting the actual recall command can always help.

-Chris


Chris,

Can you explain what you mean by this?

Thanks,

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 Post subject: Re: Recall??
 Post Posted: Tue Mar 09, 2010 8:56 pm 
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Hey Chris,

In this situation I have used NO before the recall command or after the recall command depending on the dog. So if Roush is chasing a stray cat the second he gets into his drive I'll give him a NO, HERE. IF he doesn't listen Ill give another NO, Here. Or I could start off with HERE and if he doesn't listen then give a NO...HERE. I use HERE then when he gets closer I command him to HEEL.

I like to use NO right away to "try" and get his attention and hope that he thinks that what he is doing is wrong. And since I live in the city and chasing a stray cat or raccoon can end up in crossing busy streets, etc the NO is loud and harsh.

Does that make any sense?

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 Post subject: Re: Recall??
 Post Posted: Wed Mar 10, 2010 8:41 am 
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Location: Willis
Julie N wrote:
You should never jump to the punishment until you know, beyond a doubt, that the dog understands what they should do.


This comment is KEY! If you punish (shock or otherwise) before you are 100% sure the dog knows what is expected of him then you only create confusion and distrust.

I am also a fan of the whistle. Maybe its a throw back to my Lab days but it is even louder that I can whistle and it sounds the same whether I do it or one of my sons or my wife.


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 Post subject: Re: Recall??
 Post Posted: Wed Mar 10, 2010 8:44 am 
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Location: Willis
http://www.collarclinic.com/

check out this link. I have been very happy with the refurb collor I got from them and I got mine based on a freinds good experience.

I am a fan of Tri-Tronics.


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 Post subject: Re: Recall??
 Post Posted: Wed Mar 10, 2010 10:59 am 
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I guess I`m just a red neck idiot..but I`m a red neck idiot with dogs that have been working (really working ) that come out when they are called be it in a bay pen or the woods & they don't trash... we got them there with a shock collar...

Lamar is a dear friend of mine that unleashed Panda in my home then LEFT me there with him all day to uummm "help" me over come my fear of Male Pits..
Anyway he also gave me a little tiny pinch collar for my winnie dog that didn't want to walk on a leash..he will tell you Pits require a MUCH firmer hand because of their high tolerance to pain and agrees completely with what I`m about to type ~>

Pinch collars, shock collars , a well placed boot..none of those things are violent or cruel IF YOU USE THEM CORRECTLY.


Example:
When we trash broke the Lacys as pups, we put their cut collars on them so they knew it was time to work and they didn't notice the shock collar went on as well so when they went to trash on some cows (as all young hog dogs do) we zapped them ..they thought God got em'! and it only takes one session like that (usually) then they don't trash on cows any more ..

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 Post subject: Re: Recall??
 Post Posted: Wed Mar 10, 2010 2:10 pm 
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Location: San Antonio
The word 'out" has always worked on our dogs. We have even used the shock collar as needed. The only problem we have ran into is they know when the shock collar is not on. I was washing dishes the other day and looked out the window and the dog pen was open.....children..... Well I could not see the dogs anywhere but I could hear them. I ran around the side of the house and there they were baying the steers. Problem is I don't want them baying the steers [-x . Now that it is getting nicer I am going to start working on them bringing the steers up to the arena so we can rope. This will be a project, but with some hard work it will eventually get better.

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 Post subject: Re: Recall??
 Post Posted: Thu Mar 11, 2010 12:07 pm 
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Thanks to all for your responces! I have decided to work a little harder on recalls before I spend 150 to 250 on a shock collar. I am going to use a blend of the technique that blueranger posted and what Chad uses with the coaches whistle. I will try to change up the reward regularly throughout the three weeks and try to work both of them every day. If all else fails I will buy a shock collar. Thanks again for the advice!!!

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 Post subject: Re: Recall??
 Post Posted: Fri Mar 12, 2010 6:18 pm 
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You can also get a really long lead and pull them in as you call. It will really depend on what you are doing though.

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 Post subject: Re: Recall??
 Post Posted: Sat Mar 13, 2010 2:56 pm 
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Shannon C wrote:
You can also get a really long lead and pull them in as you call. It will really depend on what you are doing though.


Yeah...I have tried that and Remi has that figured out completely...haha. Sometimes these dogs are too smart!

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 Post subject: Re: Recall??
 Post Posted: Mon Mar 15, 2010 11:57 pm 
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Location: Bel Aire, KS
Never had a recall problem with my lacy. When he was a pup, I would run away whistling with treats in my pockets. He learned real fast what whistling meant so has never really ignored me.

Does anybody have problems with recalling their dogs when the dogs are really working cattle? Had some friends who ran catahoulas on cattle and they had to shoot the training pups in the butts with a bb pellet to get them to learn to have their ears opened up because they were paying so much attention to the cattle that their ears became temporarily deaf. OFC, you would have to worry about shooting out an eye or two if you're not a good shot. Once the pups got their attention span much better, they started recalling after getting shot in the butt!


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 Post subject: Re: Recall??
 Post Posted: Sat Mar 20, 2010 10:01 pm 
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Location: Magnolia Texas
I work Ranger pretty hard on recalls since I let him off lead when tracking. Also when we go camping I usually let him off lead but I have to be able to call him in QUICK if I see a Park Ranger around.

When he was a puppy (up until about 7-8 months old), I ALWAYS got down on one knee to call him and with open arms. He got a HUGE petting reward for coming quickly. Intermitantly he got treats. It was always a party!!

Once I knew he was sure what 'come' meant and he ignored it he got a 'refresher'. I will go after him. I will walk as many miles as it takes to catch him. I do not run -- he can outrun me any day. I'm not playing a game. I am "She Who Must Be Obeyed".

Eventually he will give up & quit walking away. I make DARN sure that he know that NOT coming was the worst decision he ever made. I DRAG him back to wherever I first told him come -- however far away that is. I don't yell or whip him or kick him. I do shake him by the collar a time or two and he may end up getting choked if he won't walk but we do get back to where we were. Then I shake him a time or two more, lifting him off the ground and repeating 'I.Said.Come.' in a fierce voice. Then I literally drop him on the ground turn my back on him & walk away.

He spends the next 30 minutes trying to get back in my good graces. In the last year, we've only had this 'refresher' twice. We have proofed this with cats, squirrels, enticing goodies on the ground, runners/bicyclers, doves and buzzards. I am 98% sure than whenever I call Ranger, he will come.

Now if he was REALLY onto some game, I'm not sure he wouldn't be a little DEAF at that time!


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