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Patch & Sammy training video
http://www.nationallacydog.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=1919
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Author:  CAMO [ Sat May 29, 2010 10:40 pm ]
Post subject:  Patch & Sammy training video

We did some practice Friday & Sat . Patch is now 14 months old and Sammy is 10 months old Bella is 3 years old has not done much baying . We have been traing going on about 4 months now and have been in the pen a lot in those 4 months .

http://s592.photobucket.com/albums/tt4/ ... UTERUN.flv

http://s592.photobucket.com/albums/tt4/ ... OLORUN.flv


http://s592.photobucket.com/albums/tt4/ ... 0052-1.flv

http://s592.photobucket.com/albums/tt4/ ... 010050.flv

Author:  Jim Browning [ Sun May 30, 2010 9:56 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Patch & Sammy training video

Clue me in a little on what you are really looking for in the bay pen. One of the dogs stays more constantly engaged, while the other does little strafing runs really close then moves back. Which is scored better?

Author:  CAMO [ Sun May 30, 2010 11:19 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Patch & Sammy training video

The goal is to stay engaged with the hog . They are not suppose to look out or turn out they are to keep eyes on the hog and bay up to 3 hogs body lenghts away no farther than that. They can reposition as much as they want as long as they keep looking at the hog.They can bite to stop the hog from running but lose points for it if its not needed. Bella the dog that is in pink dosen't really bay she just started and just like to play around. She is the dog you are talking about with the zipping attacks in on the hog . I put her in just to fire up the other dogs.The runs are for 2 minutes or 3 minutes depending on what bay you are at. My biggest problem is keeping them focused for that long especially when they are on a hog that just sets up.They like when the hog runs and moves .You would think that 2 minutes is not a long time but when you lose points for mistakes it seems like a life time. This was a good practice for us I finaly got Patch to quit trying to catch . We also stayed on the hog even though it just set up and did not move much . That was what we worked on for 2 days be for they would engage then get out then back in . That is what Bella does . You lose 10ths of a point for all mistakes they make. As the handler I have tought them bad habits ( I am in training also never bayed or trained bay dogs ) such as the staying engaged or the lack of it. I got some advise at the last bay from a guy. He that said at next practice as soon as they quit or disengage even for a second to pull them out of the pen and make them sit and watch the other dogs. He said it will teach them to stay engaged or they have to get out. They do not like watching from the outside it was some good advise and has really help . Friday we started that and in a couple of hours made big differance . We did the video tapes on Sat. and what a big change it made.we still have a ways to yet.

Author:  Jim Browning [ Sun May 30, 2010 11:51 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Patch & Sammy training video

Thanks for the info, Camo. I can certainly understand a dog not wanting to stay totally engaged on a hog that just stands there, and I think the dog would naturally look back to the handler to see what's next. Makes me wonder how to apply clicker training to the pen work. You could certainly click and treat for getting closer, and to prolong the engagement, but the hog might be just a bit too interesting compared to the treat. It always seems backwards to do do something, like clicking and treating, that interrupts the desired behavior, but it does work. You would click and treat at first for any engagement, then require the dog to get closer and closer, and only then extend the duration. It would be tricky to avoid the dog shifting focus to you, but I think it's doable if the training plan was worked out properly.

Can someone send me a pig?

Author:  AmberLowMiddleton [ Mon May 31, 2010 8:41 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Patch & Sammy training video

I can bring a small one to the meeting, Jim. I'm sure it could ride back in your carry-on bag. :))

Author:  Rachael Connally [ Mon May 31, 2010 6:18 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Patch & Sammy training video

Those are some fine looking Lacy dogs. :)
Have they ever been in the woods? If you come down to the McCoy bay, I've got a place about ten minutes away that we could hunt.

We used to have a pen with six-foot panel around it and we would pitch dogs out when they weren't baying right. Turns out, six feet isn't much to a Lacy that hates pigs and they flew right back over in about ten seconds. lol. Chula is an embarrassment in the pen. She won't bay long at all and will come back to me about half way through the time. On a hunt, though, she'll work for hours..

Author:  CAMO [ Mon May 31, 2010 6:37 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Patch & Sammy training video

Rachael thanks I think they are a good group of pups as well but Iam partcial . LOL no they have never been in the woods atleast to hunt. Bella is really my blood trail dog and she is very good at it . The Patch and Sammy I set out to just to make them bay pen dogs Mike trained them for me for 30 days and I have had them in a pen some where for the last 5 monhts every weekend Practice or competion . I haven't put them in the woods yet for 1. I have no where to hunt them 2 . It Maybe something I should do with someone who knows what they are doing it maybe safer . Also I am really trying to get them to do well in the competions and it is a little different than what you want in a woods dog from what I am told . I have never had any woods dog so I do not know much about that . Well the whole bay pen thing is new to me also Patch / Sammy and I all started at the same time 5 months ago. I have learned a lot in that short time and so have my pups. I am still a ways from where I want them to be but they just keep getting better so I am good with that. I would Like to carry them to the woods just to see what they would do.Oh I think we are going to try and make that bay I was woundering if there was a camp ground around there that have camper spot and allow a few dogs ? I would not be against going out to put my dogs in the woods .

Author:  Rachael Connally [ Mon May 31, 2010 8:26 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Patch & Sammy training video

Our place is real close to the bay and has a small cabin. I think it's about fifteen miles away. You may be able to camp there with us, if you like. Though, it'll have to be up to my dad. The pigs are everywhere, too! We love to hunt down there because we'll have a pig in about thirty minutes just about every time. It's pretty miserable in the summertime, though, without AC. lol. I'd love to let you run them with our dogs. We usually just run a pair of Lacys and lead around a bulldog or two, but extra help at the bay can't hurt.

Author:  CAMO [ Mon May 31, 2010 9:27 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Patch & Sammy training video

My camper has A/C it would be my wife and I and my 3 pups . Let me know but if not do you know if there are any camp grounds around ?

Author:  Rachael Connally [ Tue Jun 01, 2010 8:38 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Patch & Sammy training video

I don't think there are any campgrounds. I know there's a city park in Flooresville and I think they allow camping there, though I wouldn't recommend staying in that town... There's some nice parks in Seguin and San Antonio-area, but I don't think there's much south of that. What date were you thinking about coming?

Author:  CAMO [ Tue Jun 01, 2010 10:42 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Patch & Sammy training video

I was told there was going to be a night time bay at peresal on Sat July 10 2010 . we would be down on friday some time .

Author:  Julie N [ Tue Jun 01, 2010 11:46 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Patch & Sammy training video

Sammy and Patch are looking good :-BD Seems like Patch has brushed off and moved on from that cut just fine. And I can't say it enough, but all the training you've done with them is really impressive. Thank you for being so dedicated to bay pen Lacys!

Jim, Sadie's biggest problem has been staying focused on set up hogs as well. She doesn't get a fraction of the pen time that Sammy and Patch do, but I've tried some clicker-esque methods to encourage her when we do compete. I've used "Yesssss" as a marker word for things like "Watch me." Basically she's supposed to keep doing whatever she is doing and gets a treat at the end, a sorta bridge and target approach. Of course I think the hog is probably a bigger motivator than a treat, but using a marker that is associated with a treat can't hurt. Actually a lot of the bay pen guys do something similar, yipping and yelling encouragement to keep the dogs in a groove, and I think part of the reason it works is because the dogs have learned it is a marker.

Author:  CAMO [ Tue Jun 01, 2010 12:08 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Patch & Sammy training video

Thanks Julie it has been a lot of time and money but we are getting there . Patch brushed off the cut ok it took a couple of weeks but it did back him up he is not trying to catch any more as you can see. But we are getting better !

Author:  Rachael Connally [ Tue Jun 01, 2010 6:46 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Patch & Sammy training video

Oh, yeah. That's the one we are gonna go to as a group for the NLDA meeting, I think. I'll be staying at the Nueces Ranch that weekend if my plans don't get mixed up. If you'll be heading back up north afterward and no one's busted up or too tired, we may be able to stop in McCoy for a hunt. :)

I don't run my dogs in the pen as much as I used to. I love to see them in the pen as pups, but when the get bigger they get grittier and catchier, which is what I love in a woods dog. Last time one of mine caught an itty bitty sow in a pen, people went to hitting him with sticks and I was about whoop somebody's butt and HARD. I know it's disqualification, but that messed up his hunting for a good few months. :( The guys who run the Bremond and McCoy/Pearsall bays are real good about getting caught dogs off.

Author:  CAMO [ Tue Jun 01, 2010 9:05 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Patch & Sammy training video

That sounds good hope we can work it out sounds like fun !

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