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 Post subject: Natura pet foods
 Post Posted: Tue Jul 19, 2011 1:29 pm 
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Did You Purchase a Natura Pet Food

Written By: Susan Thixton
7-19-2011
Categorized in: Pet Food Ingredients, Pet Food News

A federal judge has entered an order for preliminary approval of class action lawsuit against Natura Pet Foods (Innova, Evo, California Natural, HealthWise, Mother Nature, and Karma). The suit will award any U.S. pet parent that purchased a Natura product(s) from March 20, 2005 through July 8, 2011 two hundred dollars; the suit claims Natura made false and misleading statements about the human grade quality of its food.

The Judy Ko v. Natura Pet Products, Inc. (Northern California US District Court Case number 5:2009cv02619) was settled - both parties agreed. Judge Fogel determined "class of persons" eligible to participate in this settlement as "All persons residing in the United States who purchased any Natura Product for personal, family, or household purposes (the “Class”) during the time period from March 20, 2005 to July 8, 2011 (the “Class Period”)."

"A $2,150,000 settlement fund will be reportedly created by Natura under the class action settlement. The settlement fund will be used to make payments to settlement Class Members, as well as cover attorneys’ fees, costs and expenses, a payment to the Class Representative and the costs associated with administering the settlement. Natura will also reportedly stop promoting its pet food products as human grade, human quality, or as something that you would eat yourself. To get a payment (of up to $200), settlement class members must submit a claim form by January 8, 2012." Source http://classactionlawsuitsinthenews.com

The settlement agreement requires notification of this class action in the following publications: Parade, USA Weekend, Better Homes & Gardens, National Geographic, Relish, Dog Fancy and Cat Fancy.

Natura Pet Foods (case initiated before the purchase of Natura by P&G) does not admit any wrong-doing, however they did agree to this settlement which will cost them $2,150,000.

All of this mess is based on misleading claims made by pet food. And what does the petsumer get? A lowly $200. Wow. Attorneys get rich and pet food never changes. They just design new ways to mislead pet parents.

If you'd like to file for your $200 (were a Natura pet food purchaser from March 20, 2005 to July 8, 2011), click here to visit the pet product settlement website. To read the 'Notice' including some answers to questions regarding this settlement, click here.



Wishing you and your pet(s) the best,



Susan Thixton
Pet Food Safety Advocate
Author, Buyer Beware
TruthaboutPetFood.com
PetsumerReport.com



I posted this because I know there are people around here who used to feed Natura pet foods, particularly Innova . I have no idea how much trouble it would be to get in on the refunds and usually the amount of money is so small that its hardly worth the postage, but it might be worth looking into.

Another point that I would like to make is that we trust pet food manufacturers way too much. Innova was seen as darn good dog food and people paid a hefty price for it. A shame to find out that it is just like most of the other pet food companies- liars and cheats at our pets expense.

Natura has been bought out by Procter and Gamble, so I doubt that the pet food that goes under the Natura name will get any better, law suit or not.

Betty

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 Post subject: Re: Natura pet foods
 Post Posted: Tue Jul 19, 2011 2:00 pm 
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That's interesting, Betty! The Innova and California Natural dog foods were SO popular at the grooming shop where I worked in college.

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 Post subject: Re: Natura pet foods
 Post Posted: Tue Jul 19, 2011 11:11 pm 
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It was a brand that was very popular and from what I know, one of the first brands that touted to be made from human grade food. It's a shame that one cannot trust manufacturers of something like pet food. Which is exactly the reason that I switched to raw feeding after dogs and cats were dieing from tainted food. I know what they are getting.

Betty

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 Post subject: Re: Natura pet foods
 Post Posted: Wed Jul 20, 2011 5:42 pm 
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Good post Betty... As you suggested Blue is on Raw/boney meat but i found the few times a month i do feed kibble - Artemis Dog Food it is the best Holistic dog food I have found. My concern has always been just what your post highlights is that how do you know for sure what the dog food manufacturer put into their dog food who holds then accountable and makes sure what they say is truly in the ingredients? Dog foods should be held to USDA standards- I'll stick to feeding my dog Raw and meety bone


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 Post subject: Re: Natura pet foods
 Post Posted: Wed Sep 21, 2011 10:22 am 
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Thank you for posting this. I have been feeding my dogs Innova Puppy food and then planned on switching them over to Evo after a year. I had read so many great reviews about Innova after doing a LOT of research and that was one of the best options I could come up with next to feeding raw diet.


Looks like I'm going to be considering changing up their diet really soon. Although I've never seemed to have a problem with Innova and the dogs are healthy as can be and love it very much.

Any recommendations aside from feeding a raw diet? I'm interested in feeding a raw diet just don't know enough about it and from what I've heard it is pretty costly and time consuming preparing the food, etc....


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 Post subject: Re: Natura pet foods
 Post Posted: Wed Sep 21, 2011 11:45 am 
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The thing about feeding raw as opposed to even the 'best' kibble is that raw is designed to fit the dog perfectly.

First of all, man does not know all there is to know about vitamins, minerals, enzymes, co-vitamins, etc. Nor, does man know all about the relationship between all the vitamins and amino acids and all of that kind of stuff. This is why when manufacturers of dog food find out about something important like omega 3's they start adding it to the food. Even by companies putting in all the things like real meat, the kibble is cooked. Everyone should know that cooking destroys the vitamins, etc. It may not destroy all of them, but it does lower the amount that was in there to begin with.

Another thing about feeding anything that is cooked is that it definitely destroys all of the enzymes which are necessary for digesting of food, of any kind. Fresh food has the enzymes in it to start the digestion of that food. Then, the body kicks in its own enzymes to carry the digestion along. Dogs do not have salivary enzymes as humans do, so the enzymes that they have for digesting food come along further in the digestion process. If the food is cooked, it leaves all of the digestion of food up to the body and eventually, it becomes worn out from having to do all of the work of producing enzymes and digesting food.

When you feed raw, your dog is getting what a dog needs, not what man thinks that he needs. Some people think that a dog gets necessary nutrition from fruit and vegetables and that is just not true. Some dogs will eat tomatoes, or carrots, or what ever, but a dog is not designed to eat those things. The nutrition that a dog needs, it gets from the prey that it has eaten. As I said in a post about hip dysplasia- if a dog needs joint support, then when it eats the joint from prey, it gets the necessary components of nutrition from that part. Eyes of the prey contain the good vitamins for the eyes of the dog and so forth. Another big thing about dogs eating vegetables and grain is that they do not have the necessary enzymes to digest any fruits, vegetables or grains, so that food that you are paying for in kibble, goes thru the dog pretty much undigested and the dog gets little from it. Carrots, apples, grain, all of that stuff is cheaper than meat, so the manufacturer gets a higher return for a less nutritious meal for your dog.

As far as the cost, some will say that it is expensive, others will not. That is something that will be determined in the health of your dog. I have a niece who started feeding raw when her dog was quite old. The dog had a history of getting fatty tumors and of course, they always had them surgically removed at a pretty good cost- not to mention that the dog always had to go under. After 2 weeks of raw, the fatty tumors that the dog had on her started going away. They ALL went away, totally. The body didnt know what to do with the stuff that is was getting in the kibble and so it was being stored in the body as fatty tumors. Feeding raw gives the dog what it needs, so you have much less costs in vet bills, so in this way, raw becomes much cheaper. Feeding raw bones cleans the teeth, so if you are one who keeps the dogs close, having fresh breath from your dog buddy, makes him much nicer to be close to. Then, you dont have the extreme cost of having their teeth cleaned. Some people never do that, but those who do save a tremendous amount by feeding raw meat and bones.

I cant say that my cost of feeding raw would be any more than yours of feeding an expensive brand of dog food. Thats just too much figuring for me. :)) I do spend quite a bit on meat, but I have no idea how much it would cost me to feed my dogs an expensive food. I work to find the cheapest and best food for the dogs that I can. For those who live in town and can take advantage of sales have an easier job than me as I only go into town every 2 weeks, so I get whats on sale or cheap when I am there. I do have an extra freezer that costs to run, plus I finally had to get a new one, so that was an expense that others dont have. But, again, if I lived in the city, I would not be stocking up as much as I do.

The amount of time that one spends on fixing the food depends solely on that person. Some people just give a chicken quarter out of the bag along with some liver and they are done. I have gone so far as driving about 50 miles to pick up elk parts from a taxidermist and bringing it home, only to realize that there was no way that I could get that huge amount of meat into my freezer!! :)) I wound up cutting it with a sawsall to get it into small enough pieces that I could barely carry to the freezer. But, it was worth it as my dogs loved it!!! And, it was free!!! They ate for over 3 months on that meat that only cost the gas to drive and get it. I get meat from a restaurant supplier and I can get some meat pretty cheap from them. Chicken quarters at Wal-mart or HEB cost around 60 cents a pound. I would bet that is cheaper than the expensive dog food.

What you feed your dogs depends on what you think you can afford, what amount of work you want to spend feeding them and what level of health you want your dogs to achieve. Its a decision that everyone has to make for themselves, but you are wise in asking questions and being educated in your decision. I have been feeding raw for over 3 years now and my husband thought that I was nuts when I started it. He now helps me and complains very little about the cost when I purchase large amounts of meat. He has seen the difference in the dogs and understands that I simply will not feed otherwise.

One more thing and I will shut up! When you are feeding anything that is manufactured, you are depending on that company to do the best for you and your dog. You are depending on them to use quality ingredients, make it under good conditions and sell you what they say they are selling you. That is a lot to depend on, in my opinion. As we have seen, even in human food, companies that receive money for their items all look at the bottom line and that is where anyone can be duped. I simply no longer trust anyone to put in a bag or a can the best ingredients that they can get. I realize that even raw, human grade food cannot always be what we think it is, but it is in the raw form and man hasnt done as much damage to that as he can otherwise.

Betty

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 Post subject: Re: Natura pet foods
 Post Posted: Wed Sep 21, 2011 1:14 pm 
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The cost varies depending on how you approach it. Our approach may not be feasible for you if you're not able to hunt much. The meat we feed our dogs is mostly what we kill ourselves. Occasionally, family members give us meat when they clean out their freezer.

We pay NOTHING for meat to feed our dogs. Our only costs were the upfront costs of getting started. We purchased a sawsall, which we needed anyway, and a used freezer (I think we paid $50 for it). The freezer stays in our garage and it's only for dog food. We use the saw to cut the meat into pieces, then throw it into the freezer, usually with the hair still on.

With all that being said, we don't have enough meat to feed all of our dogs raw 100% of the time (we have more dogs than most). This summer when it was too hot to hunt, we fed a lot of kibble. IMO, whatever raw we can feed helps the dogs (and our wallet).

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 Post subject: Re: Natura pet foods
 Post Posted: Wed Sep 21, 2011 1:50 pm 
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Thank you Betty for the knowledge, give me a few to take that all in and digest it myself :))


I'm very interested in switching to a raw diet. I looked into it before getting a dog and just finally made the decision to feed kibble. I reckon it was mostly because of the time consumption. I don't have the time to chop everything up into pieces for the dogs every day. The cost doesn't seem so bad though now that I've got some figures to work with. I paid $33 and some change for 15lb bag of Innova Puppy food that would last just shy of two weeks between two dogs.

Edit: Also every Sunday I would crack each dog two raw organic eggs and mix it with their food.


Last edited by Jpepper on Wed Sep 21, 2011 2:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Natura pet foods
 Post Posted: Wed Sep 21, 2011 1:58 pm 
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AmberLowMiddleton wrote:
The cost varies depending on how you approach it. Our approach may not be feasible for you if you're not able to hunt much. The meat we feed our dogs is mostly what we kill ourselves. Occasionally, family members give us meat when they clean out their freezer.

We pay NOTHING for meat to feed our dogs. Our only costs were the upfront costs of getting started. We purchased a sawsall, which we needed anyway, and a used freezer (I think we paid $50 for it). The freezer stays in our garage and it's only for dog food. We use the saw to cut the meat into pieces, then throw it into the freezer, usually with the hair still on.

With all that being said, we don't have enough meat to feed all of our dogs raw 100% of the time (we have more dogs than most). This summer when it was too hot to hunt, we fed a lot of kibble. IMO, whatever raw we can feed helps the dogs (and our wallet).



I live in Dallas county in the city and I'm here on the weekdays then usually head out to the land in Cooper where we have 160 acres off of the river. Not always able hunt for the dogs so I'm sure I'd get the majority of my supply from wal-mart or a taxidermist. But my dogs would very well be eating what is killed on the land.

I've got three dogs, only two I'm interested in feeding a raw diet though which is the Lacys. You can check my introduction thread for a description but how much food would they run thru on a daily basis? Weight ratio? My female is about a year old and weighs 37 lbs. and the male is still a growing pup around 6 months of age.


I'm sure ALL of this has been covered but could somebody point me into the right direction or thread pertaining raw diet and lacys? Something that would get me started and headed down the right path.


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 Post subject: Re: Natura pet foods
 Post Posted: Wed Sep 21, 2011 2:25 pm 
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I know that I put a lot out there to digest! :D This is my 'thing' because I am so interested in it, I kinda go crazy talking about it.

Roy usually shoots several does during the hunting season and we cut them up, much like Amber described. We do skin the deer first, but just because that is what we do. Actually, I had never thought about not skinning them!! So, maybe we will try it next time not skinning them. However, we wont be using deer for meat this year. With the drought, we just wont take any deer this year, so that is going to hurt our pocket book. Mostly I will be feeding beef hearts that I get from the restaurant guy and chicken quarters that I chop with a meat cleaver to give them the bone. They get turkey and pork and whatever rabbits and squirrels that they catch. They LOVE rabbit!

A few ways to save money if you decide to go raw. Around Thanksgiving and Christmas, the grocery stores sell turkey for less than a $1 a pound. Used to, stores would put brisket on sale around July, but they seem to be getting more away from that. But, you can usually find pork on sale. My dogs dont like chicken gizzards, which are cheap, but they do love chicken hearts which are always under my limit of a dollar a pound. It does take a lot of chicken hearts to fill up a dog tho!!! :)) If you live near a big city, you can usually buy from a wholesaler, you just have to by case lots, which is what I do with the restaurant guy.

You have posted another post while I was writing this, so I will be back later with some answers.

Betty

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 Post subject: Re: Natura pet foods
 Post Posted: Wed Sep 21, 2011 3:12 pm 
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I do not think you pay more if you feed raw. I use both purchased grocery food and hunted food for my dog and I do not believe I spend more than someone who feeds top dog food and I think I probably spend less. Especially when you take away the cost of vet bills caused by feeding chemicals, bone meal, corn and grain < (sorry had to throw that in there)
When I buy from wholesaler or grocery store I purchase whatever is on sale: Chicken, Turkey, beef, Lamb, pork (, neck, ribs, chops, steaks, ground, wings) liver, innards, fish (Fresh and canned), fish scrap (eyes, intestines, head etc..) , I also go to fishing piers and hunt processers and get all the ribs, bone waste, innards, etc.. you also do not have to use boney meet as long as you mix with egg shell powder for calcium and stool firmness .. I use both meaty bone and straight meet w/egg shell. I also feed raw veggies, some raw feeders do and some don't but I believe it helps my dog. When mixing veggies into meet you just have to make sure you break down the vegetable membrane (chop small) to get the full effect.
The biggest thing you will find is the cost is close to the same as regular dog food but your dog will look healthier, not gobble up food and unless you feed a lot of table scraps and junk they will not be overweight and once the dog gets the proper daily protein they will not over eat. When a dog eats grain and corn they will over eat trying to get the necessary protein and nutrition.
If nothing else you save money big time on the dogs overall health and vet bills. I did not know the first thing about feeding Raw before I got Blue 3 plus yrs ago and I swear by it now, from what I have learned and seen first hand over the past 3 years I wouldn’t feed my dog nothing but raw.


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 Post subject: Re: Natura pet foods
 Post Posted: Wed Sep 21, 2011 3:18 pm 
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Betty,
Blue does't care for raw gizzards either, I sometime boil them in chick brooth and he tears them up, I also cook them in the pressure cooker which he likes. he used to eat them but I think they made him sick once and now he won't touch them unless I cook e'm. Using the pressure cooker is a lot like feeding raw because you do not lose a lot of nutriant or protein like you do when straight cooking.


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 Post subject: Re: Natura pet foods
 Post Posted: Wed Sep 21, 2011 3:24 pm 
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I buy 2 bags of chicken quarters a week and then several things of hearts or gizzrds and maybe liver depending on what I grab and that feeds 3 dogs. I always give the biggest quarter to the biggest dog she is about 60 pounds a dogo/ pit and my lacys get 1 quarter. I even started the puppy on raw, we started him on meat with no bones just to get used to it and now he is getting a quarter like the rest. I am still a sucker and giving him a little kibble in the morning because he is a baby and I know he needs more to eat. Once he gets bigger I suppose we will have to buy 3 bags of chicken. All in all we spend maybe $ 16.00 a week for all of that.

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 Post subject: Re: Natura pet foods
 Post Posted: Wed Sep 21, 2011 3:35 pm 
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Jpepper below is an article that can help get you started. at the end are a few other links to information. Just remember to do what is best for you.

I will tell you something Betty told me three years ago when I got Blue and started feeding raw. I still live by this today. When a dog lives in the wild only the alpha dog gets the closest to a balanced diet and proper nutrition and before he was the alpha dog he didn't. that being said I try to give my dog as close to a balanced diet as possible but I do not sweet the details, I am not following any raw diet to the tee, I just use what works for me and try to keep it as closed to a balanced diet as possible.

May I also add.... you should feed raw to all 3 of your dogs. It can benifit any/all dog breeds

RAW FEEDING 101
By Bill Carnes
carnesw@bellsouth.net

I get questions all the time about how to begin feeding their dog a raw diet. I can only give what worked for me in the past with my dogs.
What is raw feeding and how do I know what to feed my dog?
My mantra about raw feeding is to look to nature. What would my dog eat if he was living in the wild? The answer to that is he would eat any animal he could catch and kill. So the answer to what to feed is raw meat, bones, and organs from a variety of animals. Feed mostly meat, some bone, and some organs. The exact ratio isn't critical.
What about fruits & veggies?
A lot of people feed their dogs veggies but if you look to nature, you will see that your dog wouldn't eat veggies in any measurable amounts. He might eat a few berries or maybe some grass but certainly not zucchini, carrots, potatoes or any of the veggies that many people feed. Also you must know that all the cells in all vegetable matter is covered by a think layer of cellulose. This cellulose must be crushed during the eating process in order for the nutrients in the vegetables to be available for digestion. This is called bioavailablity. The nutrients in vegetable matter is not bioavailable to our dogs because they don't have the flat molar teeth that plant eating animals do. Humans, for example, have flat molars for crushing cellulose during chewing. Dogs molars are called carnassal teeth and are not flat but work like scissors to rip and tear meat and crush bones. So, by looking at your dog's teeth, you can tell that veggies just are not appropriate food for them. The vegetable material doesn't harm your dog, but it does them no good either. Giving carrot treats occasionally doesn't hurt. Just make sure that you don't feed enough veggies to interfere with the amount of meat, bones, and organs your dog eats.
How do I begin?
First off, you want to begin with one meat source until your dog gets used to digesting meat. I suggest chicken, specifically chicken backs only for the first week. Chicken meat is easily digested and the bones are soft and pliable. The second week, I suggest chicken backs in the morning and chicken quarters in the evening. The third week I think it would be good to alternate chicken quarters with turkey necks in the evening, sticking with chicken backs in the morning. So one evening you would feed chicken quarters, the next evening it would be turkey necks, then quarters again then necks, etc. After a week of that, add another meat. I suggest pork. One pork meal that week. The next week add one meal of fish. I use canned salmon or mackerel but raw fish will work just fine. Feed with bones and organs still attached if you can get that. I feed one fish meal every week for the omega 3 fatty acids for good bright shiny coats. Then next week, try something in place of the pork, maybe lamb or beef. So, after a few weeks you will be feeding most any meat available. After a month or so of feeding raw, you can add organ meat. You don't feed a meal of organs, just add some organ meat to one or 2 meals a week. Not a lot of organ meat as they are rich and can cause runny stools. Now let's put it all together and look at the diet I feed my dogs after the introduction period. Every morning they get chicken backs. The evening meals are alternated between chicken quarters and turkey necks. One of those evening meals will be fish + organs + a raw egg (shell and all) + anything else I may have left over in the fridge. One other night during the week is for "something else". I may feed a pork roast or pork ribs or pork shoulder. It may be beef, or lamb. Just something other than chicken, turkey, or fish. That's it. I keep it as simple as possible. The more you complicate it, the more complicated it becomes. Expect your dog to have runny stools for a few days to a couple of weeks in the beginning. Its part of the process of learning how to digest meat and is normal. Some dogs don't get runny stools at all, others last for a couple of weeks.
What organs do I feed?
Liver is the most important and should be at least half of the organs fed. Any kind of liver will do. Chicken, beef, pork, lamb, any of them. A variety is best over time. Kidney is the next most nutritious organ to feed. Also lung and pancreas. Heart is not an organ but a muscle and is good to feed too. Gizzard is also a muscle.
How much do I feed my adult dog?
Each dog is different and that's impossible to say. However, begin with 2% to 3% of his IDEAL adult weight each day. Watch him over time and adjust as necessary. If he gets fat, feed less and vice versa. Many new raw feeders have this great need to measure everything. That need will quickly disappear and you will just know how much to feed. You will also stay in touch with your dogs "build" and adjust his food accordingly.
How much do I feed my puppy?
This one is a little more complicated so pay attention here. Begin feeding him 10% of his weight a day. Once 10% of his weight exceeds 2% to 3% of his IDEAL ADULT weight (not present weight), feed the 2% to 3%. All the time you are doing this you are conscious of his build and adjust the amount of food accordingly. The puppy will tell you how much to feed him by his build.
How young can I begin feeding raw?
I personally have fed a 12 week old puppy raw. I know breeders who will wean their puppies directly to raw. My suggestion is to begin feeding raw the day you bring him home.
Tell me how to balance the diet.
People worry an awful lot about balancing their dog's diet. It seems to me that they worry more about their dog's diet than their own or their family's diet. They are dogs. Their digestive systems and their bodies are not that fragile. Feed meat, bones, and organs from a variety of animals and the diet will balance itself over time. Remember that term "over time". It's not necessary to balance each meal. Balance over time. People getting into raw feeding tend to worry a lot about ratios and percentages and weights. Forget all that. Feed raw meat and bones and organs from a variety of animals and things magically work themselves out. What is ideal? The average prey animal has about 10% to 15% bone, about 10% organs, and the rest muscle and fat and connective tissue. If you feed 5% bone or 25% bone, it won't matter. 5% organs or 20% organs doesn't make any difference. Just stay somewhat in the ballpark and you will be ok. One thing I look at is the dog's poop. You will become an expert poop watcher. Ideally, the poop should be solid and turn white and powdery in a day or 2. If the poop is runny, it generally means you need to feed more bone. If it is white and powdery when it comes out, feed less bone. The poop and my dog's build is all I watch and I don't look at poop very often anymore.
Do I feed supplements?
As long as you feed raw meaty bones and organs from a variety of animals then you shouldn't need to supplement a healthy dog. Of course if your dog has a health problem, you might want to add supplements for that. One more possibility. Some add salmon oil capsules for omega 3's. I don't because I feed fish at least once a week.
Where and how do I buy my raw meats?
A good place to buy in bulk is to go to small independent grocery stores and have them order things like chicken backs and turkey necks by the case. Backs come in 40# cases and turkey necks come in 30# cases. Small independent stores are usually willing to help you get cases of meats. The big chain stores just aren't set up for such purchases. Ethnic markets are another source of meats, particularly organs. Check with restaurants and see where they get meats and try those places. Finding cheap meat is fun and will become a game once you get into raw feeding.
Can you give other tips on raw feeding and how to make it easy?
There are many and you will learn most as you go and you will have to work out your own routine. It will be complicated and cumbersome in the beginning but you will work out your routines and it becomes very little more difficult than feeding kibble. One suggestion is when you buy by the case, break up the case into meal size portions and put them in freezer bags. As you feed one meal, get the next out of the freezer to be thawing.
What about Germs from the raw meat?
The digestive juices of our canines are more than 50% hydrochloric acid. It is very deadly to the bacteria that your dogs ingest. Dog/wolves in the wild are exposed to all kinds of e-coli, salmonella, etc all the time and suffer no ill effects from it. (Afterall they lick their butts all the time!) A canine in the wild can stumble upon a carcass of a prey animal that has been dead for a week or more and will gladly eat it. I had a Golden Retriever whose favorite treat was a road kill squirrel that had been dead and laying in the hot sunshine for about a week. Whenever she ate one, there was never any side effects from it. Its safe to feed your dogs meat that has gone bad in the refrigerator. Don't worry about germs when feeding your dog. It's a non-issue. I have never heard of a dog nor a family member getting sick from feeding your dog raw.
Thats it. If you have more questions, feel free to ask me and I'll add them to the list. :) This is raw feeding in a nutshell. To learn more about raw feeding: Read the book "Works Wonders" by Dr. Tom Lonsdale You can find it at "http://www.rawmeatybones.com" . You may download it for a very small fee in PDF format.
A few informative web sites are:
"http//rawfeddogs.net/"
"http://www.rawlearning.com/rawfaq.html"
"http:rawfed.com/myths/index.html"
Please join me in discussions of dog and cat nutrition at http://dogfoodchat.com/forum/ . There are a lot of nice and very knowledgable people there who would love ot chat with you and help you switch your dog to a raw diet.
If you have any further questions, you may email me here. I hope you enjoy feeding your dogs raw. I know they will enjoy eating it and thank you profusely.
Bill Carnes


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 Post subject: Re: Natura pet foods
 Post Posted: Wed Sep 21, 2011 6:12 pm 
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I looked back over the threads and didnt find what I was looking for, but Joe pretty much covered it! I thought that info was there about how to feed raw, but it isnt, so I need to see that it gets put there.

Each one of your dogs will eat and use different amounts and types of food. I have 3 lacys and each one needs different amounts of food. Lucy and Larry, are the larger dogs but eat less than Abe who is about 10 to 15 lbs less than the other 2. When I feed deer meat during the winter, I have to feed him some fatty chicken or he will just get too thin. He runs full speed and just has so much more energy than the other two. He also doesnt live to eat. Larry lives to eat- will eat anything and will get way too big if I feed him according to the weight/food ratio. Lucy is a spayed female and 6 years old, so she also has to have less food to keep her figure! Some lacys you just cant keep weight on, so those dogs, I recommend chicken broth and fat added to the food.

I feed Lucy and Larry around 12 oz each, which is a little less than a chicken quarter. Abe gets around a pound. I pretty much know how much to feed, just from experience. It doesnt matter if you feed too much one or two days, just feed less the next time. If they get fat, feed less, if they get too thin, feed more. With your young dogs, you will feed them just like you would a fully grown dog. If you decide to feed your rott mix, you will feed him according to his weight. I am like Joe, I would feed all of them raw. You will find your way, but check out the websites on the post from Joe and we are all here if you have more questions. We have several raw feeders, so you will get lots of ideas and help.

Betty

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Betty

"You did then what you knew how to do, and when you knew better, you did
better."
Maya Angelou

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