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 Post subject: Well it finally happend
 Post Posted: Mon Sep 28, 2009 3:17 pm 
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Well after several years of raising dogs with my dad and now raising them on my own. I think i have a pup that has came down with mange. So I dont know ahole lot about it. Any info would be great on how to treat it. If it gets real bad ill take her to the vet. but if i can get rid of it with out taking her i will try it. Thanks for your help in advance

Brian


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 Post Posted: Mon Sep 28, 2009 4:17 pm 
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I don't know much about it, either. I know there are two types: Demodectic and Sarcoptic. I do know that Sarcoptic is contagious--to other animals AND to humans. I'd take it to the vet and let them do a scraping.

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 Post Posted: Mon Sep 28, 2009 4:22 pm 
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AmberLowMiddleton wrote:
I do know that Sarcoptic is contagious--to other animals AND to humans. I'd take it to the vet and let them do a scraping.


Ill second that. Also, PM Circle C or Mandy (alotatrot) on ETHD. They have a mangy rescue dog and have done a lot of research as a result.

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 Post Posted: Mon Sep 28, 2009 4:27 pm 
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Ok thanks guys


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 Post Posted: Mon Sep 28, 2009 4:53 pm 
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I say, take your dog to the vet to find out for sure what you are dealing with. THEN, change some things about how you are treating the dog. Any time a disease gets the best of an animal, whether it is pests or actual disease it is telling you that the immune system is compromised. The immune system is responsible for dealing with both problems. When the immune system is working as it should, diseases and pests do not become problems. When the immune system is compromised, problems begin to show up and they show up in the weakest part of that particular animal. In the case of your dog, the skin is where the immune system is the most vulnerable.

If you are feeding your dog kibble, I would immediately change the food to raw meat, bones and organs. Kibble is not good for dogs and destroys the immune system, giving pests and diseases a place to grab hold. Switching to raw will not necessarily take care of the mange, but it will be the best place to start giving the dog what it needs to fight disease on its own.

Betty

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 Post Posted: Mon Sep 28, 2009 6:07 pm 
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yeah there are two diffrent kinds of mange from what i understand. one can be treated and the other cannot. the vet can tell you what kind it is when they scape it and run it under a microscope.

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 Post Posted: Mon Sep 28, 2009 8:10 pm 
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Info on mange from a holistic website. http://www.lowchensaustralia.com/health/demodicosis.htm

Demodicosis (red mange) is a skin disease caused by a small mite not visible to the naked eye. This mite lives down in the root of the hair. All normal dogs have a small population of mites, but only certain animals will get a disease from mite overgrowth. In some cases, the tendency to develop demodectic mange runs in families.

The disease is seen in TWO FORMS in dogs. There is a localized form where only small areas of the skin are affected, and a generalized form where the majority of the body and/or the feet are involved. Symptoms include loss of hair and reddening of the skin. Affected areas may be scabby, crusty and sometimes itchy. Skin infections due to damage by the mite are common. Skin infections can become so severe that they threaten a dog's life, with ulcers, swelling and fever. Juvenile-onset generalized demodicosis is a familial disease and affected dogs and their parents should not be bred. Diagnosis of demodectic mange is made by examining debris from deep skin scrapings under the microscope. Dogs with generalized disease also require further testing for underlying health problems.

Treatment of demodectic mange depends on the patient's age and the severity of the disease. In the localized form, the dog may heal on its own. Many times a cream or gel will be used to aid in healing. It is important that dogs with the localized form be observed for a worsening of the condition or spread to other areas. Dogs that are intended for breeding should be observed without treatment to be sure the generalized form does not develop. Infrequently the topical medication may cause the affected areas to look worse before the areas begin to heal. If a skin infection is present, antibiotics will be needed.
Dogs with generalized demodicosis may require intensive treatment with amitraz (Mitaban®) dips or oral medications. If a skin infection is present, antibiotics will be needed.

Mitaban dip is the only FDA-approved drug for this disease. WHOLE BODY CLIPPING is required throughout treatment so that the dip solution can reach the mite down in the hair follicle. Dips are usually preceded by a medicated shampoo to fight infection. The Mitaban is packaged in individual dosing vials of concentrate which is diluted in water just prior to applying to the patient. Side affects of Mitaban can be encountered, especially in small dogs, including sedation, decrease in body temperature, loss of appetite, vomiting and diarrhea. Treatment with an antidote, yohimbine, can be used to decrease the severity of some side effects. Dips are usually applied either weekly or every two weeks according to the veterinarian's prescription. We generally recommend that dips be applied by grooming technicians in the veterinarian's hospital.

If no severe side affects are seen, treatment will be continued until repeated skin scrapes reveal no mange mites (typically 6 to 9 treatments) and for one more month after that. Scrapings will be performed every 2 to 4 weeks to evaluate response to treatment. Occasionally, another form of amitraz (Taktic®) is chosen because of lack of availability of Mitaban (but it is not an approved formulation). Different dilution instructions are required for Taktic.



Ivermectin or Milbemycin Treatment: Some dogs are very sensitive to amitraz and others do not respond even after many months of therapy. For these dogs, veterinary dermatologists often turn to extra-label use of oral parasiticides that can be used for generalized demodicosis. Ivermectin is available as a cattle worming agent (Ivomec® and generics) and milbemycin is available as a heartworm preventive pill (Interceptor®) for dogs. At very high daily dosages, these can be used to treat generalized demodicosis successfully in a majority of cases.

NOTE: Some Collies and other English breed herding dogs such as Australian shepherds, Border collies, Shelties, and Old English Sheepdogs have a nervous system sensitivity to high dose ivermectin and should not be treated with this drug except in unusual circumstances under the direct supervision of a veterinarian, who will build up to the needed dose very slowly. For mixed breed dogs of unknown lineage, the ivermectin rule is "White feet, don't treat!"

Neutering

At our hospital, our policy is that all generalized demodicosis patients be neutered as soon as their disease is under control. This is in the best interest for your dog since stress (breeding, heat cycles) can cause recurrence of the disease. This policy is intended to reduce the incidence of this hereditary disease in purebred dogs.

Animals with localized demodicosis have a good prognosis with proper care. As the severity of the disease increases, the prognosis worsens. Some dogs with generalized mange must have regular treatment for the rest of their lives while others may be cured after a variable number of months of treatment.

In all cases it is important to keep your pet as healthy and stress free as possible including a good nutritional diet, regular checkups, routine deworming and heartworm prevention.


By Dr. Carol S. Foil,, DVM, Diplomate A.C.V.D.
Dr. Sandra R. Merchant, DVM, Diplomate A.C.V.D.
Web Site

Natural treatment for Mange :
Other than combining healing Neemseed Oil and other herbs, vitamins and homeopathy for mange symptoms, also use Vit C (sodium ascorbate) of give grams orally a day, and 1 dessertspoon of Cod Liver Oil daily. Then reduce Cod Liver Oil once dog is healing.

Homeopathic Treatment of Mange

Follicular Mange

This form of mange attacks young animals under one year although the effects may be noticed at a later stage. There are two main types in this condition

*

Squamous and 2. Pustular, depending on the ages of skin attacked, whilst the type of skin also plays a part. A weak immune system is also a cause.
The mite is the cause and there is a predisposition to the disease congenitally.

*

Squamous type - hair follicles are attacked by the mite, which also inhabits the neighbouring sebaceous glands. The hair soon falls out giving a bald appearance over a wide area of skin, although smaller areas may also be affected. Corrugation of the skin is the outcome together with dryness and scariness whilst a bluish discoloration develops over the bare patches. Pruritus is generally absent.
* 2. Pustular type - in the form the hair follicles become the seat of small pustules most often seen around the mouth, outer elbow and hock and in the auxiliary region. Extension of lesions leads to the development of small fistulae, which secrete Pustular material.

Treatment.

*

Type 1

Sulphur 30c - a good general remedy which alters the conditions favourable to the development of the mite. Dose on twice daily for a week.

Kali.Arsen.30c - suitable for more advanced cases, which begin to show corrugation of the skin. The animal may be restless and seek warmth

Lycopodium 1M - this remedy will help stimulate growth of hair provided the disease is not too far advanced and destruction of hair follicles has taken place. Dose one daily for one week.

*

Type 2

Hepar Sulph 30c - possess a powerful action on purulent infections of hair follicles. In this potency will abort the pustular process. Dose one daily for one week.

Kali. Arsen 30c - as for type 1

Silica 30c - a useful remedy for those cases showing extension of lesions into fistulae dose one daily for five days

Calc.Sulph.6c - this is also a useful remedy for healing Pustular lesions, with small yellowish scabs. Dose one three times daily for three days

Mezereum 6c - a remedy which is more useful when the lesions are chiefly on the head or face. Small scabs coalesce and cover purulent areas. Dose one twice daily for one week.

Thallium Acetas 30c - Thallium in potency possesses the power of obviating the effects of trophic lesions on the skin and subcutaneous tissues. It thus encourages growth of hair on denuded areas and is suitable for long term remedy in both forms of mange. Dose one twice weekly for one month.

Also, use Bach Remedies Crab Apple and Hawthorn for approx. 4 - 6 weeks or stop when you see an improvement if before then.
You can also use Aloe Vera, garlic, parsley, wormwood, and cloves.
The basic problem is poor immune system and the diet, which needs to be totally preservative free. Use garlic raw in the food up to 2 cloves.

Here's a herbal treatment - Demodex can be hard to rid but if the dog is in general good health including natural raw diet, plenty of exercise and daily grooming this is worth a try.

*

Save all used lemon halves and place in a gallon container, at least 24 halves to the gallon. Place the jar or container in the hot sunlight or pour hot water over the lemon. let the lemon remain in the water until pieces begin to turn mouldy, then remove and replace with fresh ones, squeezing hard the old ones into the water. Do not throw away any of the old lemon water which then remains. Rub the lemon potion into all parts of the dog's body to expel the skin vermin. When pomegranates are available, the peel can be added to this lemon lotion with great advantage. Use the skins from three pomegranates to every nine lemons. (keep jar covered with a paper top -not greased paper)

For the Demodectic Mange I would suggest using a lemon tonic that you can make at home.

*

1 lemon whole lemon sliced thinly
*

1 pint water

Bring water to near boil add lemons, let steep overnight. Sponge on once a day.


Dr. R Pitcairn
Web Site

I would think that bathing the dog in Tea Tree essential oil and a mild soap would help some. A lavender spray will help kill the mites and will calm the itching. The homeopathic remedies mentioned above may be hard to find, if you were so inclined, but the essential oils can easily found at any health food store. I know that tea tree oil can be found at HEB, dont know about the lavender.

Betty

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 Post Posted: Tue Sep 29, 2009 12:38 am 
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Neutering/spaying helps greatly because it is also a hormonal based disease to some extent.


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 Post Posted: Tue Sep 29, 2009 8:18 am 
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Sounds like i need to take her to the vet. Thanks guys


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 Post Posted: Wed Sep 30, 2009 8:09 am 
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Well i took Glory to the vet yesterday afternoon. and it is not mange :-BD . But she has some kind of Skin Problem that is commn in dogs that are Blue. Forgot the name of it. Start with an L. Got some Medicated shampoo and some anti. Not much i can do to prevent it the vet said. just give her a bath pretty often. (Boy she is going to love me for that :ymdevil: ). Thanks again for all the adive

Brian


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 Post Posted: Wed Sep 30, 2009 8:21 am 
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Alopicia?

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 Post Posted: Wed Sep 30, 2009 8:49 am 
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Here's an article on the blog about alopecia. http://workinglacys.wordpress.com/2009/ ... /#more-245

If that's really what it is, Aaron needs to know.

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 Post Posted: Wed Sep 30, 2009 10:04 am 
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It must be color dilution alopecia, that's the only skin/hair condition that is specifically linked to the blue color gene.

This can happen in any dog carrying the dilute gene. It is not a sign of neglect, there isn't medication that will make it better, the balding is actually an expression of cellular damage. The dilution gene causes irregular clumping of melanin, leading to hair loss and dry skin. CDA is primarily an aesthetic issue. Besides possible sunburn on bald spots and minor itching from dry skin, there are no related health concerns. But it is a hereditary condition, so dogs with CDA should never be bred.

Be careful about the bathing thing. The advice I've heard is to never use harsh shampoos and to be very gentle when grooming. Remember, the hair is damaged, and scrubbing with serious chemicals will only make the problem worse. I've also seen a lot of people recommend fish oil and vitamin E supplements. Check out this lady's page to see what she does for her blue Doberman with CDA: http://www.seattle-attorney.com/storm/sup.html.

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 Post Posted: Wed Sep 30, 2009 10:21 am 
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Well, at least its not mange. Like Julie said, the alopecia isnt a disease so to speak and thats a lot better than trying to fight mange. The fish oils would be beneficial, I would think. They dont cost a lot and it sure wouldnt hurt to try them. You want salmon oil. You can get salmon oil most any grocery store nowadays, but you need to read the label. Some fish oils have soy in them and you dont want a plant based oil. The label may say Omega 3's or something along the line of that. Omega 3 and EFA are what you want. Cod liver oil will help, but is not as good as the salmon oil. Cheap canned salmon would be good too and the dog would love it.

I still stand by the statement that any skin condition needs a raw diet. If you could change to that, Steve, Julie, Amber or Mike and Miss (or me) can all help with that. Amber is feeding her dogs wild hogs and even if you cant feed raw all the time, as much as you could would be beneficial. When the dogs body is fighting even cellular damage and the skin is dry and itchy, it doesnt need to be fighting off the effects of kibble at the same time. A raw diet would definitely help the dog. It will not reverse the alopecia, but it will help some.

Betty

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 Post Posted: Wed Sep 30, 2009 10:24 am 
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Oh, and I certainly go along with Julie on not bathing too much. I know this is going against the vets advise, but bathing a dog strips the skin of much needed oils. In Glorys case, she is going to be dry and itchy anyway, so why add to the discomfort by additionally drying the skin? A bath once in a while would be ok, but I sure wouldnt bathe her too often.

Betty

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